[Urbanexit]

One thing that just occurred to me after reading today that the bankruptcy period in the UK is only 12 months is if you declared yourself bankrupt in england does it carry over to NZ? That way you might be able to get away with a 1 year term rather than a 3 yr term.

[kiwiinholland]

No a UK bankruptcy wouldn't extend to NZ unless you filed for bankruptcy in NZ. And you still have to hand over all your financial information to prove you can't repay the loan. Besides, bankruptcy ruins you financially for the rest of your life, you can't get bank loans, mortgages or anything else. I don't know if its worth it in the end.

[mrstacy]

Just to let you all know - I received my new NZ passport two weeks ago and havent seen any scary guys with black suits and glasses so far... (I have escaped a $20k + loan ten years ago)

At this stage I would guess they are not going to track me down.
Also, for those who are hesitant about renewing... I storngly believe that our lovely NZ passports could become the most treasured asset we own as the global shit starts to hit the fan in the coming decades.
To not renew could become the biggest 'if only I did' in your life!

[kiwiinholland]

[Urbanexit]

interesting stats

http://www.tarana.co.nz/ravinder-grover/nz-news/overdue-loans-up-$48-million.html

[Urbanexit]

Looking at these stats its only a matter of time before the whole thing collapses, people who are paying off their loan completely are heading downwards, number of borrowers heading upwards, say the same % of people leaving nz each year without paying, and the existing debts accumulating interest, I give it 15 to 20 years at most before it hits unsustainability. The less people that pay the sooner that target will be reached.

[hogffej]

12 January 2009

To: Anne Tolley – National Education Minister
John Key – NZ National Prime Minister
IRD - Overseas Student Loans Department,
New Zealand Herald
Phil Goff - Labour Party Leader
Scoop.co.nz
oops! – UK Antipodean Magazine
Gumtree - UK Antipodean Website
Auckland University Student Union
Sophia – NZ Union of Students Association
Rebecca Todd – The Press, Christchurch



Requesting justification for Student Loans Double Standard.

This is an open letter.

This is an excerpt from the reply received from Hon Pete Hodgson (of the former Labour Government) in July 2008.

“I recognise that those who graduated before 2005 and accrued interest on their loans may consider the new interest free policy to be unfair. We have not, however, considered retrospective changes to address student loan debt accrued in the past.”

Let me explain my understanding of how this all works. If you were a tertiary student in NZ and had completed your studies by 1992, your fees were minimal to nothing (up to $150 per year, correct me if I’m wrong). I am going to call this a Free Education (my parents paid more than that for my secondary education at a state school).
Then, almost overnight, fees in the order of $1500 are introduced, increasing to $4000 in the course of just a few years. Ok, fair enough, the Government is cutting it’s expenditure. However, in the same blow of the delicate National Party financial axe, they introduced interest on the money borrowed, active immediately on day one of your first year study. So while we had our heads in the books, the amount owed was crawling up.
“Woah” said the students,” this feels a little excessive considering it was free only a couple of years ago”. But the Government was adamant this was the way forward, so we marched and marched and became whinging students.
So now it’s 2005 and it appears that all that marching has finally done something, great! We spoke up in our wonderful democracy and we made a change…..no more interest will be charged to students. Ok, that’s good, but I’m not a student anymore. No more interest will be charged to Student Loan Holders living in NZ….ok, that’s good to, but I don’t live in NZ.

So the group to remain in the unfair bracket will continue to be the expat students who studied between about 1992 and 2005. There's 13 years in there where students got a bum deal. That's the 13 years that students got the tag 'whinging'.


Hon Pete Hodgson says the main reason for not retro-crediting interest paid by students while living in NZ is because you don’t want to be seen as being unfair to those who have paid off their loans. Well, discriminating against one group to keep another happy, isn’t the way NZ politics should be played out. You know better than that. Hon Pete Hodgson also says it would be “expensive and complex to administer”. Yep, probably, but fortunately you already have a crack team in place…the IRD.

An article in Christchurch’s ‘The Press’ (23rd Dec) states that overdue payments in 2008 increased to $207m from approx $160m in 2007, with a third of that coming (or not coming) from overseas loan holders. Clearly, something’s not working properly. Overseas Loan holders are feeling quite bitter. The repayment scheme needs to be re-addressed. There is an active forum in the UK for upset/stubborn NZ Student Loan Holders who refuse to pay a cent (http://forums.gumtree.com/about142161-0-asc-0.html).
Recognition of the effort most of us made (in the form of interest payments while studying and working in NZ) needs to be given.[br]
Here’s what needs to happen:
Retro-credit interest charged to all students since the scheme was brought in.
Give interest equality to all those with student loans regardless of where they live.
It’s not too late to de-alienate us expats.


Now that we have the National Party back in, here’s your chance to iron out a few of the creases that have formed since you were last in. Labour went some of the way, so let’s see how benevolent you are and make Student Loans a Scheme that should’ve been fair from the start. You brought it in – you straighten it out.

Regards,
J Goh,
J Whitaker

[Kiwitraveller25]

Im about to head to the uk for at least a year and have a student loan of $30g+

Any advise for me so i dont end up in the shit either? should i be making contact with anyone to advise i will be away or....

[singaporeexpat]

this is such a ridiculous forum. When you all signed up for student loans we all knew we were obliged to pay back the debt to the government. Virtually no country in the world has free eduction without the same middle of range taxes as NZ.

The beneficiary of a tertiary education is the individual who will reap higher wages for the rest of their lives. If you want to head overseas with no thought of paying back your debt maybe NZ is a better place because of that fact.

If you think free education is a goal then the end result must be paying higher taxes unless the nation can sell oil or plunder its natural resources. Move to Denmark, Sweden and enjoy free tertiary education and tax rates above 50%. You have to pay somehow.

I hope so of you get declined from your NZ passports.

[ontheouter]

If you read the thread at all you'd notice that this is not about receiving a free education. It is about the fact that there are different rules for different people under this scheme, and that some are charged interest and some are not. I'm happy to pay back my loan in the same way that other borrowers are entitled to - interest free.

[Urbanexit]

Exactly....and thats not even mentioning the discriminatory policy of writing off specific groups student loans if they stay in the country...ie the doctors and nurses.....who have now (if they stay) have had a free education when everyone else has to pay, that also should at least be an option for everyone.

So what we get is professions in high demand get a free ride, if you stay in NZ you get interest free loans however if you are out of the country you get royally stalked especially if you were one of the initial loan takers from 1992.

Discrimination seems to be what the NZ government seems to be all about.

[Urbanexit]

In other news looks at though the govt has finally figured out what unsustainable means and they intend to try to make it sustainable by increasing loan repayment amount on borrowers, bet thats going to be as popular as someone taking a crap in an elevator.


http://www.stuff.co.nz/thepress/4839222a24035.html

[meechie_bug]

Im moving to the uk next month after doing 2 years of study and figuring out what i was studying wasnt what i wanted and it wasnt going to be taking me anywhere. My student loan is something just over $20,000, for two years i know its ridiculous but i couldnt get student allowance, my parents couldnt afford to support me and i could only work so much. I was wondering if anyone knows what my options are? or how long you have to be out of the country for for interest to start occurring? Im considering coming back within that time frame, as long as i can afford it, for a couple of weeks to avoid the interest. Any ideas, advice would be helpful.

[Thisis]

My loan started at $19,000 and now it is $46,000. I used the repayment calculator to work out how long it would take to pay it back if I meet the minimum repayment of $3,000 each year, considering the interest per year is $2,945. Which means that out of the $3,000 only $45 actually gets taken off the loan per year.

Get this:

35 years from today if I make the minimum repayment each year I will have paid $106,500 of which $98,078 is interest. By this time it will be 2044 and I will still have $37,578 to pay.

This is INSANE. There is something seriously wrong with the NZ government. Why do they punish us for leaving NZ with this crazy interest rate. Talk about drowning you in debt. All they are doing is making us never want to go back there. They don't consider that some people did degrees that don't make them a lot of money, like mine was a degree in painting. I signed up to this loan when I was 16 years old because a nice lady in the Student Loan office said that I would only need to worry about the loan once I was making over $X and it would automatically be taken from my wages and I would hardly notice it. What a scam.

Seriously... does the interest rate need to be so high?
They don't even take into consideration your earnings when you are overseas.

They could help us out a bit by writing off some of the interest or there should be a cut off point on how much interest can be charged, I mean my interest is $27,000 on an original loan of $19,000. How can any of us be expected to get a mortgage or anything?

I'm quite happy to pay off what I borrowed but the interest is crazy.

I think that there should be interest write-offs for those who make the minimum payments. Then we would stand a chance of actually paying it off in our lifetimes.

Thanks NZ government, thanks a fucking lot you guys have really done your best to fuck our lives up.

Why don't we do a petition to the government for interest write offs for those who make the minimum repayment each year?

[Urbanexit]

The whole point is that like any government they are only looking to manage the problem until they are no longer in office, ie dump it on the next guy rather than actually come up with any solutions that could potentially be unpopular, meaning they might not get back into office and would have to forgo the power and perks that come with the position. The power and the position come first everything else is secondary

They will milk their positions as politicians for every buck they can get without implementing effective policy. Thats what being a politician is all about, personal gain.

30 years from now when all this comes home to roost ie people from gen x start to die off en masse and there is a HUGE loan amount owed which will never be repaid there will be a massive argument over whose fault it is. The government of the time will shrug their collective shoulders and blame the politicians from the past for not sorting it out then and then the whole system will collapse around them when they finally figure out the student loan isn't an asset on their books its a liability and a large one.

[Urbanexit]

If you think Key is doing something about the problem by introducing bonding schemes, think again, hes running into ever expanding shortages of skilled staff and its becoming noticeable...ie a problem that HAS to be dealt with because the electorate might become unhappy.


Un-noticeable problems don't have to be dealt with ie expats who aren't paying their loans, thats someone elses problem in the future.

[Thisis]

I still believe the people have some sort of power to change things. But the kiwis that live in NZ probably don't see it as a problem because their interest is 0% therefore I doubt many are trying to fight against it. The ones living overseas are probably either hiding from their loans or are busy making a living. What about fighting back? When I was a student we were always protesting about something in Auckland. Is everyone really passive about this issue, and does the average kiwi think it is okay that overseas students get charged interest when the ones living in NZ don't?

I agree with one of the previous posts where someone pointed out that the kiwis who do their OE eventually come back to NZ with new perspectives, experiences, skills etc. How else do you get that if you just live in NZ all your life. Does NZ not value this at all?
Is a great big loan the only reward for going and exploring what is outside of NZ? Maybe I should just live in NZ and go on the dole and get the government to pay off my interest free student loan, would that be a better solution?

In all fairness I think that interest should be written off for those who make their minimum repayments. This is far more realistic than thinking that people will pay back a loan when the repayments are almost the same as the interest for that year. There needs to be an incentive otherwise nobody will pay it off because it is too overwhelming and an obvious scam - legal robbery. The interest is just too high, they could start by not making it compound interest. The figures are shocking when you look at them - $10billion, I mean are they living in a fantasy world? When you calculate how much the total paid back would be it would be much much higher than that as the loan amount doesn't reflect the total paid back over time including interest on top of that amount.

They are obviously in a dream world, maybe it's time they woke up.

I just hope that people in NZ haven't become so apathetic that they don't fight back against this, in the name of Justice above anything.

[Urbanexit]

Fat chance of that happening mind you you reap what you sow, its the chickens coming home to roost if you ask me.

http://www.thenational.ae/article/20090319/FOREIGN/632238045/1015/NEWS

[NZ77]

To all my fellow kiwi's in the UK or anywhere else overseas - for those of you that have a student loan............
I recently returned to NZ as my father has had a massive stroke. I have been living oversea's for nearly 6yrs and have not made any repayments on my loan - dumb arse I know! Anyway I received a phone call from Hilary the other day from the IRD threatening to take my house (which I own with my husband) my loan was orginally $25 000 it is now $92 000!!!!!!! CRAZY. I have a 2mth old child and my husband has just got a job but they are now making redundancies at his company.
Each yr the gov here changes the rules on student loans, I have been advised to get an accountant and a statement from the bank to prove I cannot borrow any more $$, or to sell my house to pay back the loan.
This whole ordeal has been vry stressful, if my father was not sick I would not be here - but i guess it was going to catch up with me someday, I just did not realise they could take a joint asset, so be warned.

[Urbanexit]

Couldn't you do something like arrange to have the house put in a trust? Either way I would be seeking legal advice over the irds position, as far as I know they should only be able to claim against your half of the property.
Either that or transfer it all into your partners name if you trust him other option is to sell before any legal action occurs and transfer the money offshore before they can claim.

[Urbanexit]

I would definitely be going to the papers with that story though. Before you do though make sure you get some phone call evidence from the ird.

[zingari]

Hi all - Just after some info.

I am returning to New Zealand from England for a holiday with my son. I have a rather large student loan.

My wife seems to think that she read/heard that you can now be stopped in New Zealand and not be allowed to leave until you have sorted your loan?????? - Naturally she would be devastated if I could not return........or maybe shes more concerned about her son!! hahaha - Has anyone heard of this????? Seemed unlikely to me but who knows..........

Cheers!

[Urbanexit]

I haven't heard of any such event happening and if it did it would definitely make the papers. Even the govt isn't stupid enough to restrict your movements based on a loan agreement. If they did none of us owing money would ever return.

[zingari]

Yeah I hope so (although probably the only way I will get to live back in NZ haha ) thought it pretty unlikely they could actually force me to stay guess worst that could happen is they will know where I am and what Im doing etc - Not sure if I want to pay the £700 for a British Passport and go in on that instead???

Cheers for reply - anyone else heard anything like it???

[Masden]

Hello,

I have something enlightening to tell all the people on this forum. I don't know why I'm writing this, since I really don't care about the NZ govt anymore...

I have been through so much with my student loan. It's not a big loan, but I used to feel wretched an tortured over this. I'll never forget all that I've been through to make payments. I'll never forget the trials my government put me through -changes in government, altering of terms and conditions, rewriting policies, <sigh>... Now, It's reached the stage where I just don't care anymore.

This is the current state of play.

1. I don't want to pay my loan back. TRUE -Naturally. Nobody does.

2. I DON'T HAVE TO pay my loan back. TRUE -I will not return to New Zealand. I'm very comfortable with this decision.

3. I ought to pay back my loan. FALSE -I don't care. I don't feel guilt or anything. I just don't really care about that.

4. The Govt thinks this new scheme will make me want to return to NZ. FALSE -I stay abroad. My loans get higher. I still don't care.

5. The Govt has a serious skill shortage. TRUE -I still don't care. Not my problem. New Zealand's problem. Doesn't affect me.

6. There are advantages to paying off my loan. FALSE -If I'm not returning to New Zealand, there are no incentives. None at all. So, once again, I don't really care. Meh.


Do you know how many expat kiwis are thinking the same thing as me right now? I'll tell you... Fifty-thousand kiwi expats. Hell! No wonder it's a million, billion dollar debt. We don't really care how many times you change the policies... It doesn't even matter in our lives.

Only two things can ever change this situation:

1. The Govt hunts me down. I guess they could eventually find me and seize my assets... but would they do so for every one of us fifty-thousand expats? Pffft. No way. It's impossible.

2. The Govt writes off all interest (or the loan scheme collapses on its own). I might actually consider returning, even though the salaries are crap and living costs are high. I mean lets face it. It's not the education we mind paying for, it's the ever-accruing interest.

Otherwise... the NZ govt is going to be harping on about loans until the end of time and nothing will ever change.[/b]