MONEYGRAM SCAM

dalilacalabrese · Joined: 17 Mar 2008 Posts: 1 Location: London

Hello,
I've been recently victim of the gumtree scam.

I'm trying to find other people which have been victim of the same scam in order to take legal actions against moneygram.

moneygram in the website states that their sistem is 100% secure and guaranteed but people keep losing their money.

Can you please contact me if you have been victims or if someone you know have been victim and would like to take legal actions.

thank you everyone![/b]

unmitigated audacity · Joined: 24 Sep 2007 Posts: 7559

* collects tears *

* bottles naivity *

6xxXKesXxx9 · Joined: 05 Dec 2007 Posts: 17153

Dirty Mom · Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 1123

ajk55 · Joined: 19 Mar 2008 Posts: 2

I've also been a victim and lost over a grand. Moneygram is inefficient - none of their customer service numbers ring through and the security for receiving money is ridiculous. There is no specification that it has to be picked up at the specified location and they leave it to the discretion of a dodgy post office to check the ID of the receiver. Very archaic practices.

I'd be keen to hear from anyone interested in taking legal action.

ajk55 · Joined: 19 Mar 2008 Posts: 2

Please feel free to contact me:

ameajk@yahoo.co.uk

to discuss possible legal proceedings if you have a similar problem.

Dirty Dad · Joined: 17 Mar 2008 Posts: 2165 Location: London, England

stravanan · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 7

hi there,

just yesterday my wife and I fell prey to the same scam and lost £1070. I agree with all of your points and those made by fellow gumtree complainants. Please let me know what stage you have reached and what you have done so far. I have contacted the police, moneygram, gumtree and the fraudster's email provider and am awaiting their responses. I will be happy to support any further action and am contemplating going to a consumer watchdog or even the press as I can't afford legal action, especially now!!!

As to those of you who write sarky comments and generally take the piss, you are right, we were nieve, but that doesn't change the fact that this is illegal and that vunerable people are being taken advantage of. A final note of caution is that nobody is too smart to be caught out by a scam or organised crime as they simply expose moments of human weakness to which we are all unfortunately prone to. Therefore if you do not have anything useful to say it would be better all round if it remained that way.

stravanan · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 7

btw, i think that the problem lies equally with gumtree as it does with moneygram. gumtree appears to be aiding fraudsters by providing them with a safe breeding ground in which to operate and, in my opinion, does not provide adequate warnings to new customers about scams. This seems to be proved by the fact that so many people are being caught out over such a short period of time by the same scammer.

some of the addresses that he has been using are:

bodmike53@yahoo.co.uk
snigel19@yahoo.co.uk
bistalan@yahoo.co.uk

GUMTREE TAKE ACTION NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!

KDFS · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 10

ben_gibbons · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

I have also been scammed £1070. The guy was bistalan@yahoo.com. Clearly Moneygram is a pretty unsecure device and would gladly join in any legal action.

KDFS · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 10

stravanan · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 7

wow, I had no idea that so many people had been affected. It was indeed bistalan@yahoo.co.uk. I have been to the police but they said that they don't have the resourses to do anything. Nevertheless, try to get them to find out where the money was withdrawn, because if it is all the same place there is obviously something dodgy. Also let the police know that your case is not an isolated case and that there have been several almost identical cases in the last few days.

I'm sure that you all have, but if you have not already done so, try to mount serious pressure on gumtree because if several of us do at the same time then they really have to sit up and take notice. The email address is: <Please don't post personal email addresses for anyone on the forums. To report problems to us please go to our Stay Safe pages, thanks Admin>

In addition you can try pushing moneygram for answers but I dont hold out much hope here.

finally, you can report your case to yahoo mail and state that nearly all of the fradsters are using yahoo.co.uk email addresses to conduct their illegal business. This may do something.

Other possible actions may involve writing to the press, in particular one of the consumer columns in the weekend papers.

please all try to keep up the momentum on this because without numbers nothing will happen, but with a bit of a joint effort, I'm sure that something can be achieved, even if it is just to prevent gumtree and moneygram to be used as conduits for organised crime against innocent and vunerable people.

my email address is: handwattfield@yahoo.co.uk (and yes I am ashamed to have a yahoo address now) if anyone wants to contact me further.

cheers and commiserations

will

stravanan · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 7

One other person on another gumtree forum: http://forums.gumtree.com/viewtopic.php?t=164041
also had a similar experience. he recieved 2 emails regarding 2 different properties. He details the emails and his experience below:

Hi,
My name is Simon and I have the flat for rent, the rent is 520£ per month this includes all bils and the concil tax. I moved in Milano,Italy because I got a new job. I work in a hospital. You can rent the flat as long as you need to stay even for 2 or 3 years. The first payment will be for 2 months(1040£).In case you want it let me know so we can arrange the transaction. For me is very hard to come in UK and if i will come i must be 100% sure that I will not come for nothing. As you can see in the photos everything it's new in the flat. You have internet connection, phone, washing machine, cable TV and most important parking place.
I wait your response.

So I replied and kept in touch and it seemed to be going well, until we asked about the second bedroom and he couldnt really decsribe it very well. But then i got a reply from someone else I emailed about anothe flat:

Hi,
My name is Mike and I have the flat for rent, the rent is 560£ per month this includes all bils and the concil tax. I moved in Milano,Italy because I got a new job. I work in a hospital. You can rent the flat as long as you need to stay even for 2 or 3 years. The first payment will be for 2 months(1120£).In case you want it let me know so we can arrange the transaction. For me is very hard to come in UK and if i will come i must be 100% sure that I will not come for nothing. As you can see in the photos everything it's new in the flat. You have internet connection, phone, washing machine, cable TV and most important parking place.
I wait your response.

Ironic?? I think not. I then messaged both of these two, and surprise surprise neither emailed me back. heres the email addresses, altho he probably has quite a few...

bodmike53@yahoo.co.uk
snigel19@yahoo.co.uk

Try and let people know that if they get this response, its a scam.

Back to top

stravanan · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 7

Just for your information, here is a copy of the latest letter that I wrote to gumtree. I am still waiting for a response.

hi,

Thankyou for returning my email.

I cannot accept that you [gumtree] are in no way responsible. If it were to emerge that a website was wittingly or unwittingly providing a safe haven for terrorists to conduct their illegal business, it would be closed down in a fraction of a second.

The same applies in your case, obviously harbouring networks of organised criminals rather than terrorists. Now, if this were a one-off event, I could accept your stance, however it would appear that the problem is growing exponentially and there is a systemic faliure on your part to either alert or protect vunerable users of your website from faling victim to the scams that are beginning to characterise gumtree. This is evident from the swaithes of bitterly angry people writing about gumtree, among whom several are threatening legal action, small claims court proceedures etc.

The fact that you write a disclaimer simply is not enough and even according to the trading standards body, who I have been discussing the matter with today, think that there is a large degree of irresponsibility on gumtree's part.

If we cannot come to some sort of agreement very soon, I will be going to the press regarding my (and others') perceptions of a failing website that appears to exist to support the criminals rather than the people that it is ostensibly set up to provide. Just so you know, there are several people in a similar position to myself who are also willing to speak out against the injustices that are becoming mainstrean due to your approach of 'turning a blind eye' to organised crime.

yours,

William Attfield

KDFS · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 10

ktfalkenberg · Joined: 03 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

MONEYGRAM SCAM!!

Luckily I am a big believer in research or I could have easily fallen for this scam!! It is unbelievable what people try and get away with!

This is the email response I received:

Hi,
My name is Anne Ashton and I have the flat for rent. The rent is 540£ per month including all bills and the concil tax. I moved in Venice, Italy because I got a new job. I work in a hospital. You can rent the flat as long as you need to stay even for 2 or 3 years. The first payment will be for 2 months(1080£).In case you want it, let me know so we can arrange the transaction. For me is very hard to come in UK and if I will come i must be 100% sure that I will not come for nothing. As you can see in the photos everything it's new in the flat and the flat is fully furnished, newly refurbished and also benefits from wood flooring. You have internet connection, phone, washing machine with dryer, cable TV and most important parking place.Please let me know what your intentions are....when you intend to move in?how long you want the contract to last for?how many people would be living in it and some other things you feel i should know.
Get back to me.

When I told her I was interested - she replied:

Hi,
I work in a hospital and is very hard for me to come in UK. I can't take
the risk to leave my new job for days and when I arrive in UK to see that I
come for nothing. I want to be 100% sure that when I will meet you, we do
the rent papers then i can come back in Italy.
So i can be sure of that look how we can do:
You make the payment from your name and address to your best friend name
and address in UK using MoneyGram for 2 months rent that means 1080 GBP and
send me the scanned receipt. As soon as I see the scanned receipt that you
have made the payment, I will come in UK and you will see the flat and
maybe rent it. After that, we will go together at the MoneyGram office and
you will take the money back and pay me.So all you have to do is to find a
MoneyGram office and wire 1080 GBP from your name to your friend name and
send the scanned receipt.I am asking you this to be sure that I do not come
in UK for nothing. Hope you can understand my situations.
P.S : As I told you,I have a lot of customers interested to rent the
apartment. I will reserve the apartment to the first one that provides
me the scanned paper from MoneyGram. As soon as I have the confirmation
from MoneyGram that the money are available on his name I stop the
transactions with all the other customers

This morning I decided came into work to research the property a bit more before committing, and to research moneygram, gumtree forums etc and noticed the listing had been removed. I contacted her (and was surprised to receive a response as she worked in a hospital and I found it all very suspicious that she could respond so quickly) she said it was removed, sent me images and then asked me to send the money. I googled moneygram scam and recognised it was a money scam - incredible.

Email address was: ashtona32@yahoo.co.uk

Posting: Your Gumtree.com ad #22239013: Luxury 1 bed flat to rent in
Islington,London

I really hope people research these things before committing.. There are dodgy people out there!

Kt

I absolutely hold no prejudice to gumtree.com

the_tidy_kiwi · Gumtree Moderator Joined: 26 Feb 2007 Posts: 507

Thanks for reporting these scammers to us. We will remove their ads and try and stop them posting in future.

Remember that if you do notice a dodgy ad the please report it by clicking the 'report this posting for review by Gumtree admin' link, which appears at the bottom of each ad.

If you receive a dodgy reply to your ad then please report it to us via the 'Stay Safe' section or if it has been sent via the Gumtree system, you can click the link that says 'is this email dodgy?'

Reporting these ads helps us a lot to make Gumtree a safer website.

stravanan · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 7

unfortunately it doesn't help us get any richer! As a company you really have no shame. scumtree or scamtree would make a good newspaper headline don't yu think?

KDFS · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 10

And of course WE know what emails are dodgy to receive but the ones receiving them for the first time aren't going to have a clue so won't know to report them. Obviously if I thought I had a dodgy email I would have reported it. Plus, the postings are removed immediately so you can't report it that way either. You need to publish that email somewhere that everyone can see so people are aware. It needs to be more obvious than forums that you check after you've been ripped off and then realize the same email has been sent to so many others. Your system is clearly not working as at this very moment I have another scammer emailing me but has no idea that I know. What are you going to do about helping us. I spoke with my family member at the BBC who is MORE than willing to help me get the word that Gumtree is aiding scammers and have received interest from Watchdog as well. We await some actual assistance.

the_tidy_kiwi · Gumtree Moderator Joined: 26 Feb 2007 Posts: 507

As I have said in previous posts, we are currently working on updating our messaging on the site to make it more visible. It has been an ongoing project of ours and you can see some changes already.

When you reply to an ad offering a house to rent, you will see some messaging within the online reply form. It also has a link to the 'Stay Safe' section.

Over the coming months we will be making a few more changes, so that new users as well as old will be better educated to know what to look out for.

amaan · Joined: 08 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

I think our scammer now has a new name...I did think this was fishy,
Amaan Idea

From: Adam Stewart <adam11stew@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Your Gumtree.com ad #20722224: Lovely two bedroom flat , first floor near buses
Date: Sat, 5 Apr 2008 13:58:07 +0100 (BST)
To: amanullah brey <amaan@ananzi.co.za>

Hi,
I work in a hospital and is very hard for me to come in UK. I can't take the risk to leave my new job for days and when I arrive in UK to see that I come for nothing. I want to be 100% sure that when I will meet you, we do the rent papers then i can come back in Italy.
So i can be sure of that look how we can do:
You make the payment from your name and address to your best friend name and address in UK using MoneyGram for 2 months rent that means 1000 GBP and send me the scanned receipt. As soon as I see the scanned receipt that you have made the payment, I will come in UK and you will see the flat and maybe rent it. After that, we will go together at the MoneyGram office and you will take the money back and pay me.So all you have to do is to find a MoneyGram office and wire 1000 GBP from your name to your friend name and send the scanned receipt.I am asking you this to be sure that I do not come in UK for nothing. Hope you can understand my situations.
P.S : As I told you,I have a lot of customers interested to rent the apartment. I will reserve the apartment to the first one that provides
me the scanned paper from MoneyGram. As soon as I have the confirmation from MoneyGram that the money are available on his name I stop the transactions with all the other customers

On Wed, 2 Apr 2008 18:15:53 +0100 (BST)
Adam Stewart wrote:
> Hi,
> My name is Adam and I have the flat for rent. The rent is
> 500? per month including all bills and the concil tax. I
> moved in Venice, Italy because I got a new job. I work in
> a hospital. You can rent the flat as long as you need to
> stay even for 2 or 3 years. The first payment will be for
> 2 months(1000?).In case you want it, let me know so we
> can arrange the transaction. For me is very hard to come
> in UK and if I will come i must be 100% sure that I will
> not come for nothing. As you can see in the photos
> everything it's new in the flat and the flat is fully
> furnished, newly refurbished and also benefits from wood
> flooring. You have internet connection, phone, washing
> machine with dryer, cable TV and most important parking
> place.Please let me know what your intentions are....when
> you intend to move in?how long you want the contract to
> last for?how many people would be living in it and some
> other things you feel i should know.
> Get back to me.
>

stravanan wrote:
hi there,

just yesterday my wife and I fell prey to the same scam and lost £1070. I agree with all of your points and those made by fellow gumtree complainants. Please let me know what stage you have reached and what you have done so far. I have contacted the police, moneygram, gumtree and the fraudster's email provider and am awaiting their responses. I will be happy to support any further action and am contemplating going to a consumer watchdog or even the press as I can't afford legal action, especially now!!!

As to those of you who write sarky comments and generally take the piss, you are right, we were nieve, but that doesn't change the fact that this is illegal and that vunerable people are being taken advantage of. A final note of caution is that nobody is too smart to be caught out by a scam or organised crime as they simply expose moments of human weakness to which we are all unfortunately prone to. Therefore if you do not have anything useful to say it would be better all round if it remained that way.

Oh my goodness, the same exact scam happened to me and I can see at the same exact time as you. It must have been the same one: bistalan@yahoo.co.uk?? I have been to the police station but of course their system is "down" so I have to go back but I'm so frustrated!! There's a reason they say things are too good to be true, hey? Have you taken any action? I'm definately not taking this and will fight as hard as I possibly have to.

stravanan Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:45 am Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

btw, i think that the problem lies equally with gumtree as it does with moneygram. gumtree appears to be aiding fraudsters by providing them with a safe breeding ground in which to operate and, in my opinion, does not provide adequate warnings to new customers about scams. This seems to be proved by the fact that so many people are being caught out over such a short period of time by the same scammer.

some of the addresses that he has been using are:

bodmike53@yahoo.co.uk
snigel19@yahoo.co.uk
bistalan@yahoo.co.uk

GUMTREE TAKE ACTION NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!

stravanan Posted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:10 am Post subject: moneygram scam

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

hi there,

just yesterday my wife and I fell prey to the same scam and lost £1070. I agree with all of your points and those made by fellow gumtree complainants. Please let me know what stage you have reached and what you have done so far. I have contacted the police, moneygram, gumtree and the fraudster's email provider and am awaiting their responses. I will be happy to support any further action and am contemplating going to a consumer watchdog or even the press as I can't afford legal action, especially now!!!

As to those of you who write sarky comments and generally take the piss, you are right, we were nieve, but that doesn't change the fact that this is illegal and that vunerable people are being taken advantage of. A final note of caution is that nobody is too smart to be caught out by a scam or organised crime as they simply expose moments of human weakness to which we are all unfortunately prone to. Therefore if you do not have anything useful to say it would be better all round if it remained that way.

Dirty Dad Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:04 pm Post subject: Re: Legal action against Moneygram

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ajk55 wrote:
I've also been a victim and lost over a grand. Moneygram is inefficient - none of their customer service numbers ring through and the security for receiving money is ridiculous. There is no specification that it has to be picked up at the specified location and they leave it to the discretion of a dodgy post office to check the ID of the receiver. Very archaic practices.

I'd be keen to hear from anyone interested in taking legal action.

Over a grand? Wow, glad i'm not you.

ajk55 Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 9:30 am Post subject: Legal action against Moneygram

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Please feel free to contact me:

ameajk@yahoo.co.uk

to discuss possible legal proceedings if you have a similar problem.

ajk55 Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 9:28 am Post subject: Legal action against Moneygram

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've also been a victim and lost over a grand. Moneygram is inefficient - none of their customer service numbers ring through and the security for receiving money is ridiculous. There is no specification that it has to be picked up at the specified location and they leave it to the discretion of a dodgy post office to check the ID of the receiver. Very archaic practices.

I'd be keen to hear from anyone interested in taking legal action.

Dirty Mom Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 7:24 am Post subject: Re: MONEYGRAM SCAM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

dalilacalabrese wrote:
... moneygram in the website states that their sistem is 100% secure and guaranteed but people keep losing their money.
...

It is secure ... to the person who is at the recieving end. Moneygram exists only to pass money along - that's what the guarantee is about.

I suspect you've not read their terms.

6xxXKesXxx9 Posted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:34 am Post subject: Re: MONEYGRAM SCAM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

dalilacalabrese wrote:
Hello,
I've been recently victim of the gumtree scam.

I'm trying to find other people which have been victim of the same scam in order to take legal actions against moneygram.

moneygram in the website states that their sistem is 100% secure and guaranteed but people keep losing their money.

Can you please contact me if you have been victims or if someone you know have been victim and would like to take legal actions.

thank you everyone![/b]
If people would Buy local they would not have these problems. It is not wise to buy anything online unseen. Unless you are on Ebay or a Chain store.

m.a. · Joined: 08 Apr 2008 Posts: 1

I've just had some experience with one of those guys.
moon dave <d2moon@googlemail.com> - supposedly moved to Essex to work for Audit firm and trying to rent his flat in NW6.

MrThacker · Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 6:42 pm Post subject:

Talula · Joined: 09 Apr 2008 Posts: 2

We were lucky enough to realise almost straight away this was a con...

more email addresses to watch out for are:

pillywilly993@gmail.com

l22will02@gmail.com

Perhaps Gumtree should send a warning about this scam with any emails they send to users of the site. Also, a prominent position on the homepage of Gumtree might help. Surely this is not difficult for Gumtree to do??? I have been looking for a a telephone number for Gumtree but cannot find one. Anyone any the wiser on this matter???