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Honest John

Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 78

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:10 pm Post subject: Re: Kleeneze

barrieg wrote:

As with most businesses if you want to succeed you have to put the work in.
I get tired of people thinking that if they sign up to something like Kleeneze they are going to get loads of money without effort on their part.
People wth real ambition and a genuine will to work will make money with Kleeneze, just don't expect it overnight.
As for the expense part, do you need to mortgage your home to start a network marketing business, no.

Do you know of any business that doesn't have to shell out some money for the tools, No.

YES - BETTERWARE

Do you know of any worthwhile business or job that doesn't require a learning cycle, No.
In short Kleeneze, as with my business still demands some effort and a little bit of expense but gives you a real and genuine opportunity to make a much better life for yourself, in the end it's your effort that makes the difference between success and failure.

Honest John

Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 78

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:15 pm Post subject: Re: Kleeneze

tinkapace wrote:

barrieg wrote:

As with most businesses if you want to succeed you have to put the work in.
I get tired of people thinking that if they sign up to something like Kleeneze they are going to get loads of money without effort on their part.
People wth real ambition and a genuine will to work will make money with Kleeneze, just don't expect it overnight.
As for the expense part, do you need to mortgage your home to start a network marketing business, no.
Do you know of any business that doesn't have to shell out some money for the tools, No.
Do you know of any worthwhile business or job that doesn't require a learning cycle, No.
In short Kleeneze, as with my business still demands some effort and a little bit of expense but gives you a real and genuine opportunity to make a much better life for yourself, in the end it's your effort that makes the difference between success and failure.

Good points, even a window cleaner has to buy a ladder & a bucket. I was speaking to a street cleaner last week who thought I was mad. " you mean I have to go out and if I dont get any orders I get no money? and I have to pay money. it's like me getting no pay if I get no litter in my trolley " he went off laughing ot me

The next day I spoke to a millionaire in a tea shop and told him what I did. His reply. "Wow how exciting is that Kleeneze is a major company I know a few people who started at the bottom and made a shed load of money" He was not laughing.

Isn't it a strange fact that most of the people who laugh at people like us are broke. I have never met a rich man who laughed at another man trying to do what he has done. Walt Disney had 10 broke friends apparently and when he had an idea he ran it by them if they liked it he dumped it straight away. Life is strange like that. Iit's like a learned when in managment to give tasks to very busy people who appear to have no time free. They get things done. They always find time. That's why they are busy. People with all the free time in the world somehow don't get things done.
Albert Einstine said
" Great spirits have always encountered opposition from mediocre minds"

Some great quotes here Tink, I have a similar one in a book from Amway from about 20 yaers ago

MLM BS!!!!!

Honest John

Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 78

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 6:21 pm Post subject: ANOTHER SHOCKING STORY

gumboil wrote:

Tink,

I appreciate that you are running your business ethically and honestly.

BUT! I've just witnessed a young Mum of two toddlers, who has a disabled husband and no car, crash and burn after being told that she can make around £200 per month in her 'spare' time. Hence my rather outraged post earlier and this is where my problem lies with Kleeneze. People are lied to! People who are desperate, are shown the 'income' cheques and told that they can make X amount of money for a few hours per week.

You, (and doubtless others like you), have been in the business long enough to be able to work it to suit your own particular lifestyles. If you have toddlers, no vehicle and a disabled partner, it's a different story, they're on a hiding to nothing. Surely, if a distributor wants long term team members, they should 'vet' the applicants and be up front about the time involvement etc?

Now, this lass doesn't have much spare cash/ energy as you can imagine.

What ON EARTH were the sponsors thinking??? This is not an isolated incident by the way, with a varient on the circumstances. The sponsors were so anxious to plug the holes left by departing distributors to maintain their own position, that anyone who waved a cheque book would do.

As long as this sort of attitude continues, there will be negative feedback. And it sort of contributes answers the questions about why Kleeneze has such a high turnover of distributors, nothing to do with 'Kleeneze works, it's people that don't'. People are lied to.

Hi Gum

Yes another story..........I hope the Girl & her family is OK.

Tell her to try Betterware as it is FREE OF CHARGE TO JOIN as as long as the imediate are is free she should be able to earn a bit. If she lives in Oxfordshire I have a very good contact who would be able to help her or try to help her

WELL TINK........can't wait for your response to this one

Regards
Honest John

tinkapace

Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 44
Location: Walsall

Posted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 6:38 am Post subject: Re: ANOTHER SHOCKING STORY

Honest John wrote:

gumboil wrote:

The thing is John that not all team leaders are good ones. However thee is evidence of many disabled people building solid kleeneze businesses. And there will be many more too.

http://www.go-team.org/Testimonials/DerekTelfer.pdf
and this guy is simply amazing

http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.smartcashquick.com/NOEXCUSES1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.smartcashquick.com/noexcuses.html&usg=__e0UJYSccriWMeVLSQCLUTZFrh-o=&h=948&w=549&sz=84&hl=en&start=1&um=1&tbnid=iyLT9p9dAQvHgM:&tbnh=148&tbnw=86&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dkleeneze%2Bdistributors%2Bin%2Ba%2Bwheelchair%26hl%3Den%26cr%3DcountryUK%257CcountryGB%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1

The thing is there are success stories and there are failures in every walk of life if people can achieve success in Kleeneze and not be able to walk so will others.

However it does take a very different business approach to do it some team leaders are skilled on how to train them others are not one thing is certain you must join the correct team, You must make certain you have the correct training.

BTW I detect you are ex Amway that explains a lot John. You cannot be blamed for your outlook.

People are not lied to John by the vast majority of team leaders the proof is overwhelming. However there are failures as with all businesses. I do agree however that there are some very bad distributors out there John but they do not last long. We have refused to let some people join our business they are just not suitable. And before any person in any disability situation was let in then they would be under no illusions at all as to what was required. There is no profit in signing people up to fail. I only make money if my team members do.

I feel sory for you John your opinion is very strong you will never see the good things in our business. One thing I learned years ago was it's pointless to even try and convince people like you. I see no point in debating opinions, after all thats all they are. However for what its worth

People will fail
People will succeed
Good people join Kleeneze
Bad people Join Kleeneze
Some people will be mislead
Some will not

Kleeneze is NOT perfect John nothing is for every one failure there is an apposing success. This month we have 6 new starters in our team 3 have done fantastic 2 ok one has nearly quit. On the betterware front just as I said there is always an apposing view if you look for it. Here is a report on Betterware I found that strangley enough quotes many of the reasons he failed ( and He failed) not Betterwae IMHO as the reasons often quoted as reasons BW is better.

http://www.dooyoo.co.uk/offline-shopping-misc/betterware/1120136/

I am not into arguing the toss I have no need to I help people I have many success stories in my team and many failures and there will be more too. Do you think for one moment that the look on a distributors face after paying for her entire Christmas last year by Kleeneze earnings is not motivating me, I cannot save all souls John I am not Father Christmas I am a business man.

If a doctor tries to save a man and it's imposible and he does not react to the drugs or the treatment, should he stop being a doctor or concentrate on the people he has saved and is helping. Should they shut all the job centres because more will not find work this week than will ? Is it wrong to let people take driving lessons because a proportion will NEVER pass and waste thousands of pounds on lessons ?

I think not. In your world no one would try anything if there was one person who had failed. NEVER take hope away John. Never its a crime.

There are no free lunches in BW KE or any business I repeat to base your success on anothers failure is just plain stupid.

We are just different this stupid tit for tat arguing tha many BW and KE distributors seem to enjoy is nonsense. BW is a fantastic company it has its market, so has KE we should support each other not fight its crazy IMHO a rising tide raises all ships, a storm will sink us all.

montyzuma
Community Moderator

Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 7536

Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 12:11 pm Post subject:

heres a link to others who have tried kleeneze http://www.squidoo.com/kleeneze

gumboil

Joined: 15 May 2009
Posts: 32

Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 8:48 pm Post subject:

All well and good from you Tink. I applaud your honesty. HOWEVER! As you say, there are some good distributors and there are some bad, who recruit people into into the business. This is where I feel Kleeneze falls down. I KNOW that the company makes money from all the newbies that start and fail. Catalogue sales, set up costs etc., for a very short time. This is wrong! People are consistently LIED to!

tinkapace

Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 44
Location: Walsall

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 1:25 pm Post subject:

gumboil wrote:

All well and good from you Tink. I applaud your honesty.

HOWEVER! As you say, there are some good distributors and there are some bad, who recruit people into into the business. This is where I feel Kleeneze falls down. I KNOW that the company makes money from all the newbies that start and fail. Catalogue sales, set up costs etc., for a very short time.

This is wrong! People are consistently LIED to!

Actualy Kleeneze make a loss everytime they sell a catalogue they are subsidised, I know this for a fact but it's up to you if you believe it or not but if you don't that does not by definition mean it is not true. You try producing 3 glossy mags, 1 plastic bag, and 1 order form for 67p and see how far you get. Kleeneze dont wnat your money they want your commitment. And throw in millions of pounds worth of stockholding for a catalogue pack of about 2000 items.

Also when a new distributor Joins My team it costs me money before I make any. I have travelling expenses to train them ( regardless of their location in the UK) , I provide a complete start up startionery kit at a cost of £14 per new distributor, The new distributor fills in a work book on their planned earnings and is set a plan on how to achieve this in the time that they have set. There is daily contact and free help to assist them to achieve it.

Kleeneze make money out of people !! God forbid anyone would think they were a business. But remember 50% of every penny Kleeneze take in is paid back out to distributors in Profit & Bonuses. FACT.

rooke

Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 17

Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:02 am Post subject:

montyzuma wrote:

and on the other side

http://www.ciao.co.uk/Kleeneze_Catalogue__Review_5615673

> Kleeneze was expanding at a geometric rate. The population of the UK could not sustain such a growth. To put it simply - the "growth phase" of an MLM company is the time that it is relatively easy to get to "the top" of the network. Little skill is required. Just keep introducing people and ride the growth wave of the company. This is why people get up to the £10,000+ per month cheques. No skill just the mindset to introduce more and more people into your organization at the right time. I spoke once with the (then) owner of Kleeneze at one of the company functions. Although he was quite drunk, he admitted that the growth phase could not be sustained and the business would level out. I estimated that Kleeneze would continue to grow up to aprox £100,000 and then "level out". When this leveling out occurs it would then begin to become very, very difficult to recruit people and retain them. I predicted that many areas in the country would be "saturated" with Kleeneze catalogues - some streets receiving two or three catalogues per week! I saw that this would have a heavy impact on recruitment, retention and above all public opinion. If you are a new agent that has recently joined the business and cannot recruit - don't worry! You are not doing anything wrong. As the business continues to expand it becomes more and more difficult to recruit people. If you had joined back in 1991 (the optimum time) you would have a whopping cheque too! Finally I predicted that after the growth phase, turnover would level out and eventually (after a time) start to decline. Why would it start to decline? Read next point.

> The next fundamental flaw is the attrition or "drop out rate". Back when I started the drop out rate was not high. However towards the end of the late 90s the drop out rate of agents became higher and higher. As more and more catalogue distributors hit the street some areas started to become heavily hit with Kleeneze catalogues. Agents were getting sick and tired of "overlapping" other agents with their catalogues. The customers did not take kindly to this either. The attrition rate of distributors quitting the business became phenomenal. I will not go into the drop out rates here but they are well documented on forums and review centers on the internet. Almost everyone in the country will know somebody (even if they don't realize it) who was in Kleeneze and quit. This creates a very bad public opinion of the business opportunity.
> Next flaw. Very simple quick flaw. The UK population does not react well to business opportunities in general. Brits are naturally skeptical and cynical folk. Very
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difficult to present a catalogue business that generates incomes in excess of £10,000+ per month! True but very unbelievable to the majority. I would like to point out in Kleeneze`s defence that it is in no way Pyramid selling. Many people have published this accusation on many web sites and forums. This is simply untrue. The people who post these accusations are ignorant to what Pyramid Selling IS and MLM (Multi Level Marketing or Network Marketing) ISN`T. Without going into the details let me assure any readers that Kleeneze / MLM or Network Marketing for that matter is NOT Pyramid Selling. Pyramid Selling is illegal in the UK and most countries throughout the world and people should get their facts right before publishing posts on the internet. I was involved with the company for 7 years and I did not or do not break the law.

> Products. Some of the Kleeneze products (in my opinion) were not of high quality. Some were overpriced. Kleeneze used to sell an "All In One Body Stocking" for £9.99. The same product could be purchased in a Glasgow cash `n` carry for 39p! The exact same product from the exact same foreign manufacturer. Not good for moral! In order to experience another growth phase Kleeneze would need to expand into other European countries. I did not think that the culture of some of these countries would tolerate high priced often substandard products.
There were many many other products that were simply embarrassing to sell. The "felt protector kit" for example was intended to protect polished surfaces from being scratched by ornaments. I can remember how much this product was but it was at least £5. What did you get for your money? A few round pieces of felt about the size of a one pence piece. I used to cringe when one of our customers would order one.
One Christmas we got an "exciting" new product to sell - a musical Santa and Frosty the Snowman. Santa and Frosty were two Christmas dolls that would sing in unison. Cute product for Christmas. We were told at one of the Kleeneze national conferences that Kleeneze were the exclusive distributors of Santa and Frosty in the UK. Alas - two weeks later an identical product pops up in Argos at half the price! After Christmas we got told off by the Director for not selling enough! Some distributors I know were buying Santa and Frosty at Argos and passing them onto the customer. Even at our discounted price - Argos was still significantly cheaper.
Another dreadful product was the Kleeneze bath cleaner. One of our customers cleaned her bath with it and it seriously stained her bath. Kleeneze had to be threatened with court action (by her) before they finally paid for a new bath almost a year later.
Now don't get me wrong there were good, innovative products too. The defrost tray for example would defrost mean with no electrical power, an ingenious idea (I still don't know how it worked) but there were (in my opinion) extremely overpriced. There were other strategies to squeeze more profit from the catalogue at customer's expense. Many of the cleaning products were sold with the trigger spray sold separately. This meant that many customers would receive their cleaner in a bottle with no way of spraying it on their work surface. Often the trigger that attached to the top of the bottle was nearly as expensive as the bottle itself!.
> Many European countries do not allow unsolicited mail through a residential letterbox. As this is Kleeneze`s main method of selling to the public, European expansion looked grim. There was also talk back in the late 90s of a change in law in this country making unsolicited catalogues illegal.

> Politics. The politics I experienced in the Kleeneze business were extraordinary. I held open recruitment seminars at my meetings in Glasgow. This is the way I thought it should be. However, other groups did not follow suit. I was training distributors up here in Glasgow who were not in my business. However, my distributors down in London (for example) could not attend the training and recruitment seminars down there. As it turned out I was training a certain persons distributors in Glasgow, however, the favour was not being reciprocated for my distributors in London. Distributors high up the marketing plan distribute verbal propaganda to convince the distributors in their organization that their group was the "best". This inevitably led to intense rivalry and even hatred between certain Kleeneze groups. The company also seemed to back up this practice by awarding these distributors with holidays, cups and sports cars. On numerous occasions I had distributors in my organization poached into rival Kleeneze businesses with lies and propaganda. Some of my Gold distributors (I had 7 in total at various levels) were actively poached away from my downline while they attended the company achievement holidays! They would suddenly disappear from my downline only to appear in another line of sponsorship. I reported this activity to the company who ignored it.
More politics. Read on. I produced tens of thousands of opportunity brochures and manuals for my downline distributors. As a gesture of good will and hoping to put an end to the rivalry between different Kleeneze lines of sponsorship, I made these sales and recruitment aids available to EVERY Kleeneze distributor in the country. I was actually threatened from high up distributors from other lines of sponsorship not to distribute this material or there would be consequences! All because their photograph did not appear on the front cover! This was the "nail in the coffin" for me and I made a concious decision to quit dispite my sizeable income.
> Groups achieve cult status. My uplines actively discouraged me and members of my business from associating with people who decided to leave. Even friends and family! Propaganda was spread. People who left the Kleeneze business were "negative" or "pond life" apparently. When I eventually left all of my friends in my Kleeneze business were actively discouraged from talking to me! Ever again! This includes family as well as my friends! Rumors were spread about me, I was misquoted and my name blackened so as to discourage people from associating with me. Disgusting attitude. I left the business with 7 active downline Gold Distributors and a healthy PSG. I was regularly earning £3000 per month. I left out of principle. I do not think highly of the principles of some of my upline!

Good on you. i started 8 months ago, and trust me a few years ago i would have said the same as everyone else on here... however i needed money.. what the first post says is nearly correct, you do lose cat's you do pay for your kit, and you do top up alot at the start. but anyone who wants to succeed will.. its a numbers game the more out the more orders ( no matter what climate we are in people still order).
It annoys me so much when people assume we are wasting our time, its a good bloody business with a brilliant set up. we have alot of support from our uplines, and meet some fantastic people. and people who earn millions doing this, wern't handed it on a plate they worked hard and are now getting the rewards. your right nothing in this world is free. but kleeneze give you the opportunity to build your own business and earn as much as you can. and you have the freedom to work where and when you want. you couldn't set up a successful company without money no matter what you do. i hear day in day out people saying they need extra money, they are struggling, and i offer this to them. hard work is needed in the of set but once you build your customer base your are making money for very little hours. Granted you need to recruit to build a business, but hundreds of people do this who only retail and they earn steady incomes. maybe you should all be a little bit more open minded. i was and its changed my life, i don't need to send payslips and prove anything. because i know what i earn and i know how hard i have worked. and i know i would never go back to working 40 hours a week for a rubbish income. we may be wasting our time on a sham business as most of you say. but you know what i spend as much time as possible with my children, if i need to go somewhere i dont have to ring in sick or take a day of. if i fancy a break i go, i enjoy been able to stay in bed an extra hour if i choose to and i enjoy not having to travel to and from work. and been able to go for a cuppa when i want, i love the energy i have and the time i get to spoilt my husband i oh and i get more money coming in working 15hours than i did working a full month in a dead end job.. as kleeneze say its not a job its an opportunity and only people who are willing and wanting to change there lives will.. so say were sad and that we have hidden intentions to try and recruit people. but when we recruit we take people who want to succeed and we help them and coach them and stay in contact with them and we invest alot of our time into them so its not like we take there money get them in then leave them. but the people who don't stick with it are people who are afraid of hard work and have no motivation to change there lives. Im just a normal person and i love my life and my career and i enjoy going to work so if im sad then you know what fan bloody tastic

rooke

Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 17

Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:20 am Post subject: Re: ANOTHER SHOCKING STORY

tinkapace wrote:

Honest John wrote:

gumboil wrote:

YOU KNOW WHAT, ITS EXCUSES. I HAVE 3 CHILDREN AGED 5,6 AND 1YEAR. I TAKE MY YOUNGEST SON WITH ME IN MY PUSHCHAIR. I DON'T DRIVE BUT I STILL MAKE MONEY... THEY DO SAY CAN EARN FROM £200 A MONTH WHICH IS £50 A WEEK. IT IS DONE AND CAN BE DONE AND WILL CONTINUE TO BE DONE. WE DO NOT PRODUCE FAKE CERTIFICATES OR INCOME. THEY ARE OUR OWN AND PROOF THERE IS MONEY TO BE MADE. ANYONE CAN DO THIS JOB NO MATTER WHAT THERE BACKGROUND. AND WE DO NOT JUST TAKE CHEQUES TO BENEFIT OURSELVES. WE DON'T ACTUALLY MAKE MONEY FROM THE KITS WE MAKE MONEY FROM PEOPLE WHEN THEY MAKE MONEY SO IT IS NO BENEFIT TO OURSELVES TO BRING PEOPLE ON BOARD WHO DON'T OR WON'T DO THE JOB I WON'T SAY CAN'T BECAUSE EVERYONE CAN IF THEY PUT IN THE EFFORT PEOPLE WHO USE EXCUSES WON'T DO NOTHING WITH THERE LIVES AND THAT'S WHY THERE WILL ALWAYS BE STIGMA AROUND THESE TYPE OF COMPANIES BECAUSE THERE WILL ALWAYS BE PEOPLE LOOKING FOR AN EXCUSE TO FAIL. AND BETTERWARE DO OFFER A FREE KIT WHICH IS SMALL BUT COULD GET SOMEONE STARTED HOWEVER THE WAY THEY RUN THERE COMPANY IS VERY DIFFERENT TO KLEENEZE I LOOKED INTO BOTH. IF YOU WANT A BUSINESS IN BETTERWARE YOU HAVE TO COLLECT AGENTS CASH AND ORDERS YOURSELF. SO YOU CAN BE RIPPED OF AND YOU GET GIVEN AREA'S WITH KLEENEZE YOU CAN GO ANYWHERE. BUT YES FOR SOMEONE WHO HAS NO CASH THEY COULD JOIN BETTERWARE. OR THEY COULD GET FUNDING FROM GOVERNMENT FOR THERE STATER KIT. (DEPENDING ON CIRR).. THERE WILL ALWAYS BE BAD AND GOOD STORY'S ABOUT ANY COMPANY BUT THAT'S PEOPLES OPINIONS BUT PLEASE DON'T KNOCK SOMETHING TILL YOU GIVE IT A GO

ian the jedi night

Joined: 10 Aug 2009
Posts: 10
Location: planet zog

Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 12:27 pm Post subject: done it tryed it

you may remember i was going to try the better w**e company i did and made money with a lot of time and hard walking it worked not rich but 30 to 45 a week and my friend tryd the kleen 1 and now in dept they just want a idiot to build the pyramid it does work but not with kleen

Honest John

Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 78

Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:54 am Post subject: ADMIN CAN WE PLS GET RID OF THIS THREAD!!!!

ian the jedi night wrote:

you may remember i was going to try the better w**e company i did and made money with a lot of time and hard walking it worked not rich but 30 to 45 a week and my friend tryd the kleen 1 and now in dept they just want a idiot to build the pyramid it does work but not with kleen

ANOTHER dream sold & I bet hes earning thousands Rolling Eyes

I GUARANTEE this person was told to respond so to this thread to get this to the top of the forum again Evil or Very Mad

By the way...... Betterware Area Managers pay into an insurance against bad debts so NO they can't get ripped off. get your facts right Exclamation

Good luck spending you millions of pounds a week you will earn in 1.......No.......... 2...........No...........3 years..........NO NEVER

99% of Kleeneze = Scam ..............END OF THREAD

montyzuma
Community Moderator

Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 7536

Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:06 am Post subject:

Re your guarantee I wouldnt have thought so as he is saying his mate did kleeneze and is in debt seems a strange way to promote it. the fact that it works on a pyramid principle makes me very suspicious of anyone promoting it.

Russet Guzzler

Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 1565
Location: Near Stokey Fire Station

Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:54 am Post subject:

The Kleeneze around today bears no relationship to the original company - the name has changed hands a few times over the years Until recently it was part of the Farepak hamper group that you may remember scammed savers out of their Christmas Hampers... Beats me how anyone can be taken in by brain-washing Multi Level Marketing schemes that appear to make more money out of recruiting new agents than selling goods to end users - specially when you see all the Area Managers listed on Google

tinkapace

Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 44
Location: Walsall

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 12:01 am Post subject:

Russet Guzzler wrote:

The Kleeneze around today bears no relationship to the original company - the name has changed hands a few times over the years

Until recently it was part of the Farepak hamper group that you may remember scammed savers out of their Christmas Hampers...

Beats me how anyone can be taken in by brain-washing Multi Level Marketing schemes that appear to make more money out of recruiting new agents than selling goods to end users - specially when you see all the Area Managers listed on Google

Making money out of recruiting new agents is illegal. Every network marketing company has to quote the following phrase on it's paperwork by law."It is illegal for a promoter or a participant in a trading scheme to persuade anyone to make a payment by promising benefits from getting others to join a scheme.""

simply put this means....

Neither yourself, nor the person that introduces you to Kleeneze will make a single brass farthing from you acquiring a distributorship! Income is generated by commission and bonuses on retail sales made when customers order through the catalogues. Rewards are performance related. You as a distributor will not earn if you do not put out your catalogues! Your Sponsor may put in considerable effort to support you and train you before he/she receives any reward from the company based on your success. Again, nobody earns merely from your signing a distributor agreement form

Kleeneze was indeed owned by Farepack and they sold it off as a profit making concern before they went bankrupt. Kleeneze is now owned by Findel. Kleeneze has never made a loss in its 86 year old history.

Kleeneze turns over £120 million a year in products to end users. Kleeneze could not exist in the UK if it broke the law by making money out of people joining.

Russet Guzzler

Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 1565
Location: Near Stokey Fire Station

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:49 am Post subject:

Yep, you all come out with the same time-share type sales pitch, but you don't convince me...do you get alerted by HQ to rush in and post more sales spiel? The only people who are likely to make worthwhile income from MLMs are the company and the team leaders that run their recruits and cream off commission on every sale Each new recruit has to shell out for leaflets of someone else's stock - much of which can be bought from Wilkinsons, 99p shops, market stalls, shopping ads in the weekend papers, and from exhibition booths where vendors smart talk the gullible into buying tin and plastic goods "that no housewife should be without," but which ends up unused at the back of the kitchen cupboard soon after it's got home Everyone should Google the catalogue online and see for themselves what's on offer - it's an eye opener I don't doubt your company makes money, but I do doubt the single agent at the end of the line even gets the equivalent of the minimum wage

tinkapace

Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 44
Location: Walsall

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 5:17 am Post subject: Facts

Russet Guzzler wrote:

Yep, you all come out with the same time-share type sales pitch, but you don't convince me...do you get alerted by HQ to rush in and post more sales spiel?

The only people who are likely to make worthwhile income from MLMs are the company and the team leaders that run their recruits and cream off commission on every sale

Each new recruit has to shell out for leaflets of someone else's stock - much of which can be bought from Wilkinsons, 99p shops, market stalls, shopping ads in the weekend papers, and from exhibition booths where vendors smart talk the gullible into buying tin and plastic goods "that no housewife should be without," but which ends up unused at the back of the kitchen cupboard soon after it's got home

Everyone should Google the catalogue online and see for themselves what's on offer - it's an eye opener

I don't doubt your company makes money, but I do doubt the single agent at the end of the line even gets the equivalent of the minimum wage

Im not trying to convince anyone I dont have to if you chose to Ignore the facts that's your perogative. 60% of active Kleeneze distributors earn over £500 every 4 weeks, 30% over £1500 every 4 weeks. In our team we have retailers earning over £600 every 4 weeks without teams and the largest UK retail only earner is a guy called Jun Li (google it) who earns around £40k PA. I earned £390 in my first month from retailing without any team. Every Kleeneze distributor gets income proof every 4 weeks every claim can be proved. I personally retail around £4k of goods from the catalogues every 4 weeks.

I only deal in facts not opinions I can prove every single word I say. 100% and it's backed up by TV repots, newspaper articles and monthly sales figures. If you are interested in the truth let me know you are welcome to see all the facts.

montyzuma
Community Moderator

Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 7536

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:09 am Post subject:

hi tim can you remove your www link form you signature please

tinkapace

Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 44
Location: Walsall

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:36 am Post subject:

montyzuma wrote:

hi tim can you remove your www link form you signature please

Tis done,

montyzuma
Community Moderator

Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 7536

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 7:00 am Post subject:

Ta, have a fab day.

Russet Guzzler

Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 1565
Location: Near Stokey Fire Station

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 1:45 pm Post subject: Re: Facts

tinkapace wrote:

I personally retail around £4k of goods from the catalogues every 4 weeks.

Which translates into income to you after tax, expenses, NI of....?

To get anywhere near a reasonable (I nearly typed "decent" - but that hardly seems appropriate) living you'll need to leach off a team - who could probably take home more as cockle pickers

tinkapace

Joined: 10 Apr 2009
Posts: 44
Location: Walsall

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:13 pm Post subject: Re: Facts

Russet Guzzler wrote:

tinkapace wrote:

I personally retail around £4k of goods from the catalogues every 4 weeks.

Well Sir This is a pointless discussion as you are obviously not in the slightest bit interested in an educated debate on this point. I will leave you to your opinion and you can leave me to build my business. I neither have the time or inclination to justify my very sucessful business with you.

I will leave you with just one thought. Just because you refuse to believe it does not make you correct. I know that there are people in my team earning good incomes and every single one of them earns more from their own efforts than I do. I also earn more than the person who introduced me to Kleeneze. You have no idea of my business or the incomes and circumstances people in my team. Even to hint that my living is not "decent" when you have no personal knowledge of me and my ethics is disgusting. I will not reply to your childish remarks agian.

Russet Guzzler

Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 1565
Location: Near Stokey Fire Station

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: Facts

tinkapace wrote:

Russet Guzzler wrote:

tinkapace wrote:

I personally retail around £4k of goods from the catalogues every 4 weeks.

I understand your sensitivity - answering the question truthfully would show that either you couldn't live on selling £1000 of goods per week or the margin must be extremely high to give the commission you indicate...

Russet Guzzler

Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 1565
Location: Near Stokey Fire Station

Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:51 pm Post subject:

It's noticeable how new logins appear every so often to try and justify the MLM schemes... I hope the skepticism of right-minded folk causes the wavering to think hard before signing up

Honest John

Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 78

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:42 am Post subject:

montyzuma wrote:

Re your guarantee

I wouldnt have thought so as he is saying his mate did kleeneze and is in debt seems a strange way to promote it.

the fact that it works on a pyramid principle makes me very suspicious of anyone promoting it.

Hi Monty

I wouldn't trust any of them Evil or Very Mad

I see that Tink is back on again & as I suspect it was to bring this thread to the top again!!!!

I think Rooke was generalising a tad but from my good contact @ B/W area managers dont get ripped off for the money they collect from their agents as they have an insurance which covers them. At every level its an honest earning opportunity but it wont make you rich. AN HONEST INCOME FROM AN HONEST COMPANY imo!!!

I spoke to my good contact in B/W & he was telling me this week of a KZ agent living in Abingdon, Oxon who had all her books stolen Shocked

Scum as far as I'm concerned & that's first hand experience

Regards
John

Honest John

Joined: 21 Jul 2009
Posts: 78

Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:54 am Post subject:

Russet Guzzler wrote:

It's noticeable how new logins appear every so often to try and justify the MLM schemes...

I hope the skepticism of right-minded folk causes the wavering to think hard before signing up

Hat's off to you Russet & your replies

I wouldn't go as far to say all MLM companies are BS er's but just 99% of them Laughing

I always say if you believe in who you work for them sing about them.

Why is it that 99% of MLM companies never use their name when
advertising for people

99% of KZ are scumbags - theres more horrors than successes

Regards
John

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