[nicobie]

Has anyone had any experience dealing with agencies like Flatland and Flatfinder?

An earlier topic thread made Spacelet sound pretty bad... what about these other ones?

[Charlie64]

Hi Nicobie

Agencies like these have just been discussed in another post - do refer to the post from therealcleo, "Where has my post gone?".

And please do NOT use these so called "agencies". Their practices are illegal - they try to charge you a fee before you find and take a property.
It is a criminal offence for agencies to do this. They are permitted to charge tenants a fee only if you take a property through them - and NOT before. Do refer to the other posts I've mentioned as Bluey has posted very useful quotes from Shelter and Citizen's Advice (or look up their websites).

If you do hand over your money, you will discover - too late - that their "properties" are quite frankly dreadful - tiny, shabby, etc.
And do note, that they have been advertising the same properties in the same areas, often the same street names, for over 4 years!

More reputable agencies often do have more expensive properties on their books - however, it is better than being ripped off.
Although, its perhaps better if you are on a low budget, to try a private landlord (of course, keep your wits about you and try to use your intuition over whether they are above board or dodgy) - or stick to flatsharing.

[ArtSake]

I only found this forum today because I was curious about the Flatland service. Thanks for the warnings, I'll ignore them. (Flatland, not the warnings.)

Sounds like they need to change their tagline to, "Breaking the law since 1971!"

[bubbles1585]

i went to the flatland office a few days ago and they seem to know what they are doing...i know the initial fee is a bitch but then u can access thier database of landlords then you deal directly with them....the landlords or people loooking for a tennant in a flat share.....they were all preety young and seemed to want to help you as much as they can...

[metalchix]

Save your £50 and a lot of time and frustration.

[riz]

Yes everyone said they are illegal, but why are they still in business after several years?

[mobile43.co.uk]

[ArtSake]

As far as I understand it yes, that's the illegal part.

I would guess that as with most dubious "estate agent" practices, they don't get prosecuted by people who are so desperate they have to use such a service. In other words if you need somewhere to live badly enough, you'll pay the fee and won't complain.

If someone took the trouble to complain to the police, what would happen? Probably the police wouldn't fancy it. After all Flatland could just say, "Oh right we didn't realise - we'll stop" and then ten minutes later they charge Mr and Mrs X, who've just arrived in the country and need somewhere to live, for access to the database because they have no idea the police were just in or what the law is.

As with most dodgy agent practices it will take either a very conscientious copper or a dedicated reporter for anything to happen ... and that only happens very rarely. Meantime there are needy "customers" to exploit!

And I've never had dealings with these people... but I do know a lot of agencies get away with murder

[drumin7]

I've been doing some investigating into this. You guys are right about estate agents not being able to charge up front fees. It is illegal to charge for lists of properties. However - it's not illegal to charge to be an 'appointment making service' - which is what these companies are. You can check issue 1199 of oops! Magazine for back up on this.

I'm not trying to be anal - I used FlatFinder and found them to be great. They found me something within a few days and their service was top-notch. When I read what you guys had written I wanted to know if I'd been ripped off with the up-front fee....But...NO...That's wasn't case! I was new to London and didn't want the wool pulled over my eyes! So, I phoned a few solicitors and looked in some antipodean media. I am happy that I made the right decision. Personally I would recommend FlatFinder.

[Bluey]

Fair enough - nice enough to get another perspective on this.

Personally, I think that the 'appointment fee' is a cynical ploy and loophole to get around the law which doesn't permit them to charge for viewings or to register on their books.

I haven't heard of any other reputable estate agents (I mean those regulated by ARLA and other organisations that have a complaints system and protection from the agents running off with tenants and landlords money) that charge this kind of fee.

Estate agents make money from both tenants and Landlords for their services. In my opinion, they are already poor value for money and additional fee to their management and tenant referencing charges is most unwelcome.

[ArtSake]

That does sound like a miniscule distinction between charging for a viewing and charging for appointment making. I wonder if that would "stand up in court"

Nonetheless, well done and congratulations to drumin7 on getting what you wanted.

I don't think Flatland charge for management actually Bluey, if I remember what I read correctly then once the tenancy is secured it's over to the landlord on that stuff.

I do agree that agents per se are poor value for money ... just the middle man exploiting both sets of people who have to use their services. When I advertised on Gumtree for a flat a while back I was dismayed that 50% of the replies were from agents when I'd asked for LANDLORDS to reply. They like getting their teeth into everything - it's money for old rope.

[Bluey]

Sorry, I couldn't have been clear on my post - I meant that letting agents charge the landlord for management fees. At the same time often also charging both tenant and landlord to draw up the tenancy agreement, then some additional fees to the landlord for inspection reports, inventory and so on, then further additional fees to the tenant to take up their references.

This dual charging from both parties is one of the reasons why I'm not particularly impressed with the notion of an appointment fee, which is probably virtually indistinguishable from viewing or registration fees that letting agents are not legally permitted to charge to prospective tenants.

Only 50% of calls were from estate agents trawling the ads? My mates rate their timewasting calls closer to 90%.

[klmdude]